Snow Leopard Update Kills Hackintoshes

DAB

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Not really a big surprise, all companies protect their intellectual property. No different than MS, Sun, Cisco or anyone else with intellectual propertly to protect!

I personally wish Apple would allow their OS to be installed on any PC. In fact I think they would sell a good many OS packages if they allowed it. None the less this is just Apple doing what Apple does. This is one aspect of the company that I don't care for, but have grown to expect.
 

Chob

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Not really a big surprise, all companies protect their intellectual property. No different than MS, Sun, Cisco or anyone else with intellectual propertly to protect!

I personally wish Apple would allow their OS to be installed on any PC. In fact I think they would sell a good many OS packages if they allowed it. None the less this is just Apple doing what Apple does. This is one aspect of the company that I don't care for, but have grown to expect.
I didn't realize they had that policy until I saw that story yesterday. But I didn't know much about Macs until I started looking things up before I got my Macbook Pro.

I can't imagine it would have anything but positive effects by gaining more of a market share with more people using OS X. But what do I know?
 

jef

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I can't imagine it would have anything but positive effects by gaining more of a market share with more people using OS X. But what do I know?
People tend to forget that Apple is a hardware company. They make the OS to entice you to buy said hardware. They aren't interested in having to support a million possible combinations of motherboards, chipsets, NIC, etc. and they don't want you running their OS on hardware they didn't make.
 

memebag

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People tend to forget that Apple is a hardware company. They make the OS to entice you to buy said hardware. They aren't interested in having to support a million possible combinations of motherboards, chipsets, NIC, etc. and they don't want you running their OS on hardware they didn't make.
Yup. Apple saw early on (then briefly forgot) that there's very little money in commodities. Windows PC makers are all competing with each other to deliver the most computer for the smallest profit. Apple can charge more because they keep their system closed and people are willing to pay a premium to use their stuff.
 

Chob

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Yup. Apple saw early on (then briefly forgot) that there's very little money in commodities. Windows PC makers are all competing with each other to deliver the most computer for the smallest profit. Apple can charge more because they keep their system closed and people are willing to pay a premium to use their stuff.
Makes sense. They want people using their computers.
 

DAB

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Yup. Apple saw early on (then briefly forgot) that there's very little money in commodities. Windows PC makers are all competing with each other to deliver the most computer for the smallest profit. Apple can charge more because they keep their system closed and people are willing to pay a premium to use their stuff.
That is EXACTLY right! However, don't you think this is likely always what has caused them NOT to grow into real competition for Windows or PC's for that matter? If you listen to their commercials you'd think they really are huge competion, but in reality they aren't. The reason being is that most want the most bang for the buck and so that leads them right to Windows and PC's.
 

jef

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That is EXACTLY right! However, don't you think this is likely always what has caused them NOT to grow into real competition for Windows or PC's for that matter?
I think what sealed their fate was their insistence on huge margins back in the early days. PC's, even though arguably inferior in their user interfaces at the time, were cheap enough that people dealt with the trade-off.

If people think they pay some massive premium now, try buying a Mac IIci (and accessories) back in the day. In 1989 the Mac IIci, which was arguably one of the most popular models ever introduced, was priced at $6,700. In 2008 dollars, that comes out to $11,633.31 using the Consumer Price Index.

And you didn't get the monitor for that price!!

IIci.gif


quick edit to say that I have a IIci that I'd be willing to let go at the original $6,700 if anyone is interested ;)
 

xan_user

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Who wants to bet its to flex muscle on the netbook market prior the long rumored mactablet release?

Another brilliant corporate move that, in the end, just serves to encourage more piracy.

More importantly who wants to bet on how long it will take for a hackintosh anti-patch-patcher?
 

DAB

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I think what sealed their fate was their insistence on huge margins back in the early days. PC's, even though arguably inferior in their user interfaces at the time, were cheap enough that people dealt with the trade-off.

quick edit to say that I have a IIci that I'd be willing to let go at the original $6,700 if anyone is interested ;)
I think I'll pass, but thanks for the offer. Yeah margins have certainly been cut especially over the last few years with these netbooks. Which also isn't real good for the retailer either because their margins are lower too.

I think even today there are still folks willing to accept the trade off on these lower cost PC's vs Macs.

Who wants to bet its to flex muscle on the netbook market prior the long rumored mactablet release?

Another brilliant corporate move that, in the end, just serves to encourage more piracy.

More importantly who wants to bet on how long it will take for a hackintosh anti-patch-patcher?
I don't think you will actually see Apple even attempt to compete in the Netbook Market. I think they will put out a very decent Tablet computer, which will compete with other PC based tablets on the market, not netbooks. I think Steve Jobs has made it clear he isn't interested in making dumbed down low margin netbooks. They certainly could have, but I think in their corporate world a low end cheap Mac would cheapen the brand as whole.

Piracy would happen even if you could go buy copies at stores. Look at Windows it is still pirated today and like Apple MS has fought these things tooth and nail by making changes to their activation systems and rolling out there genuine Windows software that virtually pulls the plug on the computer working if you don't upgrade it to a genuine windows keycode.

There is little doubt like Jailbroken iPhones there will continue to be Hackintoch patches to try and circumvent what Apple does. Hell look at Palm constantly trying to circumvent the use of iTunes. All they are doing is just creating havoc for their phone customers instead of just building their own freaking music store and syncing system.

Apple like many other fortune 500 companies that have intellectual property will continue to do everything they can to protect it. I wish it wasn't like this, but being a business person I fully understand it. If it were me I'd bust iTunes wide open and let any device connect and buy from the Apple Store. I'd certainly be selling copies of OS X and why would I care if they are installed on other PC's, but I think someone else said it best. Apple isn't going to try to support anyone else's hardware so for them to allow OS X would mean many would have a poor experience with it. However, I don't think they should actively be trying to block those that do want to use it and are willing to deal with them not supporting every ones hardware.
 

xan_user

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Its not so much that they aren't going to support it, as they are intentionality breaking the functionality that's already there.

If netbook owners are too cheap to buy a mac anyhow, why would apple not want to at least get some coin and market share from the cheapskates on the os ? It makes very little business sense to me in this particular case especially/ But I can see the threat of the higher performance hackintoshs, as it competes directly with apples hardware sales.

It would seem to me that the owner of a cheap hackinetbook might grow to like the Mac OS and might actually start seeing the value in buying a full on, more powerful mac next time. -or heaven forbid, they fall in love and convert all their computers, and friends computers, to the macult. Isn't that the ultimate long term business goal? To get as many people to pay to use your stuff as possible?

Sure its great to have 500 customers that can give you 2 grand for a new toy, but why not also have the other 10,000 customers that cant afford to part with 2k give you a $100 too?
Fact is people want a macnetbook, and jobs wont allow it or make one. if I was an apple share holder id sure want cupertino to start getting money from the financially challenged rather than driving them off.

Instead a some jilted netbook owners with now dead hackintoshes will vow never to give jobs any $, ever.

Just another childish and short sighted business move motivated by short term greed.
 

jef

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Instead a some jilted netbook owners with now dead hackintoshes will vow never to give jobs any $, ever.

Just another childish and short sighted business move motivated by short term greed.
It's not all greed, its also support costs. If those people paid for OS X, they would expect it to work well on their various hackintoshes. Apple isn't interested in just selling an OS, and they most definitely aren't interested in selling an OS that requires an infinite combination of drivers. Those people who want OS X will eventually come around or they won't. Those that don't most likely would never have spent a dime anyway.

Apple, under Steve Jobs, is far from shortsighted when it comes to business moves.
 

memebag

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Its not so much that they aren't going to support it, as they are intentionality breaking the functionality that's already there.

If netbook owners are too cheap to buy a mac anyhow, why would apple not want to at least get some coin and market share from the cheapskates on the os ?
Because no one will pay extra for Mac hardware if you can run Mac software on commodity PCs. And without Mac hardware, the whole Mac lifestyle experience dream shrinks.

It would seem to me that the owner of a cheap hackinetbook might grow to like the Mac OS and might actually start seeing the value in buying a full on, more powerful mac next time. -or heaven forbid, they fall in love and convert all their computers, and friends computers, to the macult.
That never happens. I've known Hackintosh builders for over 20 years. I've never seen one pony up for Mac hardware. Why would they? They can get better hardware cheaper and still run Mac OS.

Just another childish and short sighted business move motivated by short term greed.
Short term greed would prompt Apple to open their system. They'd get immediate return for a tiny investment. Long term greed keeps their system closed, and lets Apple charge a hefty markup on cheap Chinese and Korean components. Meanwhile, they get to laugh while Chinese and Korean component makers gobble up the Win PC vendors that can't figure out a way to convince buyers there's something special about their boxes of cheap Chinese and Korean components.

There's nothing sexy about commodity markets.
 

xan_user

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It's not all greed, its also support costs. If those people paid for OS X, they would expect it to work well on their various hackintoshes. Apple isn't interested in just selling an OS, and they most definitely aren't interested in selling an OS that requires an infinite combination of drivers. Those people who want OS X will eventually come around or they won't. Those that don't most likely would never have spent a dime anyway.

Apple, under Steve Jobs, is far from shortsighted when it comes to business moves.
Weird move to have nothing in between the iphone/pod and 15"mac for a portable offering, no? I mean customers have been clamering for a smaller sized mac for quite a while now. If they wont make em, fine but dont break ones that are currently working, intentionally!

Apple doesn't have to support the chips/harware officially if they dont want the CS and comparability headaches, but by officially nuking a class of, up to now working processors, will only stop some folks that might switch to unhacked macs from even trying it out and will also encourage some to stay hacked rather than go legit.

Hey if jobs wants to grow based on preventing the kind of experimentation and openness that he so vastly benefited financially from, so be it. I just think , given all that others have offered him when he was starting out and again when his chips were down, its disrespectful, bad business and extremely poor karma.

...and here I thought jobs was into all that karmic Buddhist stuff?

Guatama Buddha - “If you find your mind tempted and entangled in greed, you must suppress the greed and control the temptation; Be the master of your own mind.”
Guatama Buddha - “There is no fire like passion, there is no shark like hatred, there is no snare like folly, there is no torrent like greed.”
:idunno:​
 

DAB

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It's not all greed, its also support costs. If those people paid for OS X, they would expect it to work well on their various hackintoshes. Apple isn't interested in just selling an OS, and they most definitely aren't interested in selling an OS that requires an infinite combination of drivers. Those people who want OS X will eventually come around or they won't. Those that don't most likely would never have spent a dime anyway.

Apple, under Steve Jobs, is far from shortsighted when it comes to business moves.
I agree with you jef, folks can say what they want, but when you look at Apple's profitablity and what they have done over and over again and again through the last 5 years, the sales figures are mind blowing.

Steve Jobs and his board are about one thing. P R O F I T! All the rest of this stuff he just doesn't deem it as important. Long as they are making these huge profits and in the drivers seat, they will continue to operate in the manner in which they do. Why break something that is clearly working!

Yeah to say that Jobs and company is shortsighted clearly means you aren't look at the same thing as investors are for sure!
 

IdRatherBeSkiing

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Because no one will pay extra for Mac hardware if you can run Mac software on commodity PCs. And without Mac hardware, the whole Mac lifestyle experience dream shrinks.
A computer is a lifestyle experience? Its a box on my desk (a cheaper box on my desk at that). So is Apple selling hardware or a 'dream'? If Apple was a religion I would say it was a cult. Some cult members are being asked to drink the kool aid here.
 

DAB

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A computer is a lifestyle experience? Its a box on my desk (a cheaper box on my desk at that). So is Apple selling hardware or a 'dream'? If Apple was a religion I would say it was a cult. Some cult members are being asked to drink the kool aid here.
You know what gets me about comments like this is the mere fact that a lot of folks that run Mac's probably run PC's too (not all of them). You can vale it up by saying if it was a religion, but the point is the same. I know on this forum I do, MM, RoscoRyan does and I am sure there are others. To say just because someone owns Apple equipments means they are somehow part of a blindless/mindless cult is just totally out of the box. However, with that said, I think there are some over zeolus fans just like there are with anything. I can't speak for all the other Mac owners on this forum, but no one ever asked me to drink any kool aid and no one ever forced me to buy Apple equipment. I as a Mac owner have never pushed buying Macs on anyone, I've shared my expereinces and why I think they are good machines, but the rest is up to each individual rather they wish to buy one or not. I have enjoyed using mine and learning it; it seems to work very well and if we have the money to buy them, then that should make no difference to anyone else. Yet somehow it seems to get under the crawl of a some folks that we even talk about Macs on this forum. It is so sad when there are those that continiously find it necessary to BOX ALL Mac and iPod, iPhone owners as being kool-aid drinking cult members of Apple.

I think we are in pretty good company among the Mac owners on this forum, that also own PC's too. Many of us beta tested Windows 7 and have even purchased it since then. I for one have well over 80 PC's recently upgraded to Windows 7 within my agency, OMG don't tell STEVE he'll throw me out of the cult! hehehe

Honestly I wish Apple was more open and less protective, but then again it is their right to protect their intellectual property rather I like it or not. Same as with many of these companies.
 

jef

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Most people running a hackintosh weren't going to be Apple customers, so Apple doesn't care about cutting them off. And if Apple offered OS X but said "we don't support it" - does anyone think that would fly for someone who paid $129?

Can't remember what site I borrowed this image from, but it sums up pretty much how a lot of people view Netbooks, including Apple. Jobs doesn't want the user experience diminished, so he isn't going to make it easy to run on any old hardware that people decide they want to run OS X on. A lot of nerds love Netbooks, but if the masses were in agreement, no one would be buying anything else....




Oh, and I also own a Dell PowerEdge SC420 that runs linux and acts as a file server. I have a homebuilt whitebox - now retired because I have VMWare - that ran Win XP. I also have a Sun Ultra 10, and an Ultra 2. I'm able to not confuse my likes and preferences for some sort of religion. The anti-Apple crowd is usually more vocal about how much Apple sucks than they are about why their choice might be better, other than the cost. And if that's the criteria, I hope they all drive a Chevy Aveo.

I drank the Kool-aid from Apple in 1986, because what everyone else was selling then was actually Flavor-aid. :D
 

Biaviian

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I personally wish Apple would allow their OS to be installed on any PC. In fact I think they would sell a good many OS packages if they allowed it.
I would be buying several copies.
 

xan_user

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I would be buying several copies.
ding ding! winner!

Id get at least one for one of my two netbooks. -but apparently jobs says im i the "zone of suck"? WTF is that BS?
Apple board meeting notes-"Hey lets insult the largest growing segment of personal computing." :loser:

Ive had many laptops and played with many macbooks over the years. I love my portable 10 " netbook with 8.5 hours of runtime and matte screen. Remember i was two clicks away from buying a mac, until jobs decided that only the largest of is portables would have a screen that works outside -and the 'downgrade' to matte is 50$t extra?again wtf charging for a downgrade? Only Cupertino could have the gall to ream customers for a downgrade. :rolleyes:.


If they aren't going to support certain chips then sell an unsupported copy for half price. its still more money than getting nothing, and better than alienating potential customers.

Its like jobs doesn't really want our money, since we only carry small bils and not a pimp roll.:confused:

Lets not wax to poetic on apple profits, a lot of it came from charging customers ransom on their drm'ed songs and skimming royalties from music artists, not to mention a huge anti competitive deal with att.