patriotic thread

[JHDK]

So you're really telling me international pipelines and the politics/wars involved with them have nothing to do with what a barrel costs and thus our gallons at the pump? I know I'm being a bit reductive but I think so are you.

The plague has been happening for 2 years so all of a sudden now we're feeling it at the pump? Just a coincidence a European war happened. Yea, nothing to do with Ukraine and the Russia/Germany pipeline and all that bullshit those Arabian nations use to profit from it.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

So you're realling telling me international pipelines and the politics/wars involved with them have nothing to do with what a barrel costs and thus our gallons at the pump? I know I'm being a bit reductive but I think so are you.

General rule: if there is a crisis in the world that can be used as an excuse to raise the prices at the pump, the price at the pump will be increased.

That being said: Russian oil is about 20% of the oil used in Europe. They are now using 0%. So the 20% is being grabbed from the world supply creating increased demand thus increased price.

 

[scotchandcigar]

Oh, I forgot one other thing. Gas prices track with the economy. No one's going to pay $4/gallon when they don't have a job. But when the economy is strong, they'll pay. So if you look at 2017-2019, for example, gas prices were up, and in 2020 they were way down. But now, as screwed-up as things are, the economy is strong.

 

[JHDK]

Oh, I forgot one other thing. Gas prices track with the economy. No one's going to pay $4/gallon when they don't have a job.

OK that makes sense but the first positive jobs report came out like 4 days ago. We added like 650k jobs. That's great. But really? 1 good report in over 2 years will shoot gas up more than $1/gallon? In 4 days?

Yea, nothing to do with the war and pipelines.

 

[scotchandcigar]

So you're telling me international pipelines and the politics/wars involved with them have nothing to do with what a barrel costs and thus our gallons at the pump?

Absolutely. The oil cartels who set prices don't give a shit about some 20 year plan to get 0.5% of our oil from a pipeline. The immediate increase/decrease in drilling, fracking, shipping, and sourcing, far outweighs any significance from potential limited sources.

The plague has been happening for 2 years so all of a sudden now we're feeling it at the pump? Just a coincidence a European war happened. Yea, nothing to do with Ukraine and the Russia/Germany pipeline and all that bullshit those Arabian nations use to profit from it.

Gas prices hit lows because of the recession caused by the pandemic. They have been rising as our economy has been recovering, and people have been getting out more. And as I keep saying, we're not in normal times. A big cause of rising prices is supply chain problems, and worker shortages. The war in Ukraine certainly adds a lot on top, because it affects a significant worldwide supply, and it is immediate.

 

[scotchandcigar]

1 good report in over 2 years

I'm at a loss. Where are you getting this from? Unemployment has dropped from like 20% to 5% or so, it's been a couple of years of recovery.

 

[scotchandcigar]

 

[JHDK]

Gas prices hit lows because of the recession caused by the pandemic. They have been rising as our economy has been recovering, and people have been getting out more. And as I keep saying, we're not in normal times. A big cause of rising prices is supply chain problems, and worker shortages. The war in Ukraine certainly adds a lot on top, because it affects a significant worldwide supply, and it is immediate.

K. I can agree w/this.

But can't you say "were not in normal times" every time we hit $4/gallon? We weren't in normal times under GW when I remember it last being over $4. We were directly involved in 2 wars.

We're never in normal times...that phrase is not a justification.

And like it or not, true or not, the President is the guy who takes the hit for gas prices.

Also the jobs reports you may be right abt. I'm just going off headlines abt how this last one was the first one to beat expectations in a while.

 

[scotchandcigar]

But can't you say "were not in normal times" every time we hit $4/gallon?

I'm not as young as some of you, yet surprisingly, I wasn't around for the pandemic of 1918. So putting 1918 aside, the supply-chain issues, worker shortages, and (yes, still) worldwide affect of Covid on businesses is unprecedented. There has not been a period like this in my lifetime.

I've never said "we're not in normal times" during any previous spike in gas prices. There are a number of reasons it's happened before, but it's never been due to a lack of ability to move things around the world.

And like it or not, true or not, the President is the guy who takes the hit for gas prices.

As gas prices are always higher in a good economy, this just proves that people don't understand anything.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

I go back to my general rule of politics. I had applied to the stock market but this can apply to gas prices too.

If the gas prices go up and you are the party in power, then it is market forces beyond your control
If the gas prices go up and you are not the party in power, then the current party is directly responsible for the price hikes.
If the gas prices go down and you are the party in power, then you are directly responsible for the price reductions.
If the gas prices go down and you are not the party in power, then it is market forces beyond anybody's control.

 

[geosync]

Haha tough sledding for everyone except the one selling the gas. We're up to 5 bones per gallon here. 4.69 if you go certain places. The wife and I were musing over $.99 gas prices in 1999. 5 bucks would last me a whole week. I paid 68 bucks a few weeks ago mistakenly hitting the wrong pump, and don't drive a huge truck.

 

[Aaron]

/Corporate Greed/

 

[JHDK]

I go back to my general rule of politics. I had applied to the stock market but this can apply to gas prices too.

If the gas prices go up and you are the party in power, then it is market forces beyond your control
If the gas prices go up and you are not the party in power, then the current party is directly responsible for the price hikes.
If the gas prices go down and you are the party in power, then you are directly responsible for the price reductions.
If the gas prices go down and you are not the party in power, then it is market forces beyond anybody's control.

HAHA.

Way to be the voice of reason.

 

[scotchandcigar]

I go back to my general rule of politics. I had applied to the stock market but this can apply to gas prices too.

If the gas prices go up and you are the party in power, then it is market forces beyond your control
If the gas prices go up and you are not the party in power, then the current party is directly responsible for the price hikes.
If the gas prices go down and you are the party in power, then you are directly responsible for the price reductions.
If the gas prices go down and you are not the party in power, then it is market forces beyond anybody's control.

This is the way a lot of people respond to these things.

For me, the party in power has little or nothing to do with A) the economy, B) the real estate market, C) world/US gas prices. The first 2 are cyclical, and are affected by factors independent of the US administration. And the last one has already been discussed.

If I were to post the graph of which administrations coincided with a better economy, some people might not like it. But that would be political, so I won't.

 

[JHDK]

Jesus dude, can you never give an inch? IDK you kinda come off condescending now and then. And don't worry, I know I come off as an arrogant ass pretty often.

I mean I like ya Scotch but you gotta just chill sometimes. You clearly think you're smarter than I and I actually probably agree with that.

(and I think I'm no dummy so that's a concession btw. The average person I talk to I can run circles around so I guess that's why I like our debates here cause I get a real challenge.)

But that doesn't mean my points don't also make sense.

Then Idrather jumps in and diffuses the whole thing. Let's just leave it there.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

I think this discussion is a good example of why we avoid politics on this board. Too many potholes.

 

[sadchild]

We weren't in normal times under GW when I remember it last being over $4. We were directly involved in 2 wars.

This statement supports my two thoughts.

1) I agree that gas prices aren't simply based on/the fault of the political party in power (despite how many Facebook shitheads insist on it). Last time we paid this much it was a Republican.

2) War (specifically in the middle east) can and has been a factor in gouging the American consumer. Just like last time, here we are again with headlines about war in the Middle East. Time to gouge the consumers!

Case in point: In late 2001 we went into the Middle East (Afghanistan, then Iraq). Gas prices began to steadily increase from just over a dollar in fall 2001 to over three bucks in 2005. Meanwhile, ExxonMobil reported the highest profits EVER for a business in HISTORY for three years in a row! 2004, 2005 and 2006.

/Corporate Greed/

Exactly

 

[JHDK]

way to come w/facts sad.

 

[scotchandcigar]

Jesus dude, can you never give an inch? IDK you kinda come off condescending now and then. And don't worry, I know I come off as an arrogant ass pretty often.

I honestly don't know what you're referring to. You're going to have to point it out.

In my last post (that you are flipping-out over) I said 3 things:
1) I agreed with IRBS about his viewpoint. I said "yeah, that's how a lot of people respond". What is offensive about that?
2) I stated my opinion that 3 trends are not caused by politics/government. IDK what could be offensive about that. If you don't agree, then you don't agree. Am I saying anyone is wrong about anything?
3) I mentioned that there's a graph which correlates governments with economies. I don't want to start anything, so I'm not posting or discussing the graph. And in any case, it's a statistic that could be argued one way or another, so I'm neither stating nor purporting facts. What's offensive about that?

 

[sadchild]

From an outsider perspective (and nothing to do with the content of the posts)

But maybe you've heard there was a pandemic recently? ... Remember seeing this?

It may not be intentional, but when I first read this, it came off patronizing and condescending.

Yea, nothing to do with the war and pipelines.

And this came off as "I'm laughing at your assessment of the situation (which I asked for)".

FWIW